A less "vague" Query attempt...

[John Oberon]

Keith,

I don't see how my re-write could be taken as though she's completed only three chapters and a synopsis. It says it's a 100,000 word book; are you thinking 33,000 words per chapter? The re-write was meant to show her that she can tell the story concisely without vagueness or unneeded detail. I would expect her to change it to her own words and make it fit whatever agent she's sending it to.

[Keith .]

I only singled out your rewrite because I'd already addressed hers. My opinion is to either say the manuscript is complete or redo your next to last sentence. Agents often get queries from newbies who don't know that fiction, unlike non, must be complete before pitching. I was fine with your rewrite except for the last graph.

"The Tributary is a 100,000-word women’s fiction. The synopsis and first three chapters are available upon request. Thank you for your consideration."

With 100k being such a round number, I worried it could sound like an estimation. It was just my opinion, as I said, and I offered it.

[John Oberon]

I guess I don't understand the problem. Unless you give an exact word count, it IS an estimation. It's pretty typical to round to the nearest thousand words, isn't it? First you said it sounded like she finished only three chapters and a synopsis; it didn't. Then you worried that 100K sounded like an estimate; it is - so? 100K sounds like a complete book to me. I suppose she could tack on the word "complete". Whatever...she'll change the wording to suit whatever agent she sends it to.

[Keith .]

Fine, John. Pour yourself a bowl of cereal and argue with it, too. I gave my honest opinion. Hopefully this thread isn't sufficiently hijacked so that PennMom gets no further advice.

[John Oberon]

I was not aware that I was arguing. I was trying to make some sense out of your honest opinion - rather unsuccessfully, I'm afraid. But you understand whatever it was you were trying to say, and maybe PennMom can make some kind of sense out of it.

[John Hawkwood]

Mmm. I think I see what Keith is thinking, or at least something in the neighborhood of what Keith is thinking, since my idea doesn't really match to what he wrote

Saying a synopsis and three chapters are available upon request - if that isn't what the agent has said is his/her next step after a query - could (I say COULD) be read to imply that that's ALL that is available to be requested. It would be kind of odd if an agent did read it that way, but it's not impossible. And if the agent concludes that's all that is available to be requested, he/she may think (a) it's because the author is for whatever reason not willing to provide anything further for review or (b) there's nothing more to be reviewed because only a synopsis and three chapters have been written so far. If it's (b), then the agent could conclude that the "100,000-word" bit is aspirational - the author doesn't actually have 100,000 words or anything close to it, and is just saying "This is where the book should fall if/when it is completed." Thus it's an estimate - not a rounding-off, an actual forward-looking estimate, or what we would otherwise call a prediction. (Or if you're feeling less charitable, "wishful thinking.")

I find it all pretty unlikely, but generally agree that asking to send the synopsis and three chapters or saying that a synopsis and three chapters are available is not good form for a query. Do your query, let the agent tell you what he/she wants. Understand that the agent will probably tell you that he/she wants to apologize for using a form response, but...

Also, there's no such thing as "a 100,000-word women's fiction." You need to add the word "novel."

[Rogue Mutt]

John Hawkwood Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Also, there's no such thing as "a 100,000-word
> women's fiction." You need to add the word
> "novel."


Except if you say "women's fiction novel" you'll sound like a dunce because all novels are fiction. There's probably a less awkward way to say it.

[Keith .]

Thank you, JH. I did a poor job expressing my opinion but you hit it on the head. I was discussing revisions with my agent last week and she mentioned in passing that she is bombarded with queries from folks, particularly young ones, who've made just these mistakes. She signed a teen author and sold book and movie rights a while back. That debut just came out and may explain why they're targeting her. Anyway, thanks.

[John Oberon]

John,

Huh. Well, I suppose it COULD be read thataway with some pretty hefty mental gymnastics, but by golly, if I read that a book is 100,000 words, I immediately think that the book is 100,000 words and that the author knows it's 100,000 words because he wrote it...particularly if I see that statement in a query. And if the synopsis and first three chapters are available, I understand it to be the synopsis and first three chapters of the 100,000-word book. I suppose if you're an agent that's in the habit of expecting lies and then inferring them into plain statements, maybe...but really, I don't know see you get anything but the book is 100,000 words and the synopsis and first three chapters of the book are available upon request.

As for the synopsis and three chapters thing, I expect she'd tailor that to whatever requirements the agent has or generalize it to fit just about any requirement.

[Keith .]

Feel better?