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  1. #31
    Comma Boy

    Re: Lennon, Lennon, Lennon...

    To my knowledge, nobody here has said you're without talent. Talent you got. But talent without direction doesn't create great art, or great products (and yes, writing can be considered both art and product).

    You want us to tell you you're already wonderful? Sorry, I can't. You're not - at least, not YET. But that's just my tastes. And hell, I'm not wonderful yet, either, so what do I know?

    We're ALL working on this. It's a vocation fraught with insecurity. You'd probably do well to read up on this lifestyle - Annie Lamott in particular addresses the insecurities writers face in her book "Bird by Bird."

    You seem eager to prove yourself as a heavyweight. Again I point to the John Fowles example. Learn to walk before sprinting. Picasso could paint photo-realistic art, and did so before he started taking a left turn. Thus far much of what you write shows creativity, but lacks comprehensibility. More than one person has observed this here. So maybe if you tried just telling a friggin' STORY first, you might then establish the foundation you need for your Joycean flights of fancy.

    But here's my brutally honest opinion: If you want to follow this path of unconventional speculative writing, do it. Do it hard, and do your best. Be assertive and stake your claim on the artistic pioneer. If your @!#$ is any good, it may work.

    But you undermine yourself BADLY by coming back every five minutes asking us if we like it.

    Picasso didn't do that. Joyce didn't do that. If you're going to be bold, be bold fulltime. Right now you vacillate between being an idealist artist and a needy schoolgirl. Pick one, and move on.

    Good luck.


  2. #32
    Feather Luster

    Re: Lennon, Lennon, Lennon...

    Patti, your phrase:

    I scan the leaves of the forest floor looking for a sign of my baby brother, seeing nothing that resembles his tiny form.

    ... is perfect. It creates a picture and it draws me into your story.

    For inspiration and encouragement, I suggest you read Audrey Coloumbis's young adult novels, SAY YES and GETTING NEAR TO BABY, written in first person/present tense.

    She and I share the same agent. I wish I could say that she and I share the same talent!!

    Keep going. I, for one, think you're on the right track.


  3. #33
    patti new-writer

    Re: Lennon, Lennon, Lennon...

    Thank you so much FL - I wrote it in first person/present and I like it that way too. I had to switch to third person when I came across an unexpected scene - where my first person character had left, but I was not ready to.

    Because of this, there are switches from first to third person and I have been fighting with the decision of leaving it, or changing it all to third person for awhile now.

    Going to Chapters tomorrow to do a little research on current YA novels and their POV - I will definitely take a look at the two you mentioned. May even purchase for reading this week.

    Thank you again,


  4. #34
    patti new-writer

    Re: Lennon, Lennon, Lennon...

    BTW - the switches from first to third are indicated with breaks. And except for the last two chapters (where it occurs often), could even be created as individual chapters.

  5. #35
    patti new-writer

    Feather Luster

    Just had to return and tell you that your post meant a alot. I've been having this internal struggle about POV for quite some time - your comment on one simple sentence has encouraged me to look at the whole thing again - as it was originally written. I will focus on finding a solution for my problem areas "without" changing the first person/present.

    I feel much better about the whole issue. Thank you again.


  6. #36
    patti new-writer

    Re: Feather Luster

    Murg - I know, I know ... a alot!

  7. #37

    Re: Feather Luster

    Patti, I wasn't going to say a word. (aword)

  8. #38
    Bob Kellogg

    It's all right, Lennon.

    I wasn't trying to be critical, just trying to shed some light of the dichotonmy of creating something intended for other eyes. On the one hand, you want to be creative in how you express yourself, just as twentieth-century painters and sculptors were weary of the same centuries-old esthetic and searched for a new visual language. On the other, you'd like others to react the same way you do to your output.

    Unless you both share the same system ogf communication, that won't happen. One of the charcteristics of modernism is the belief that the medium is as important--sometimes more important--as the message. Artists had to wait for the world to learn their language.

    Nowadays we're used to distortions of reality--even a total lack of reality--in visual art. When they first appeared, most viewers were offended. They couldn't understand why artists did it. Look at Picasso's portrait of Dora Maar. It's the stuff of nightmares. Any real person who looked like that would be hunted down and burned.

    It was Clive Bell, I believe, who first provided a definition of art that encompassed both Rembrandt and Picasso. Art, he said had significant form. It could be an accident, or it could be on purpose, but if it was significant in some way, it was art. (Not great art; not talking about value judgements here. Just art, as opposed to non-art.)

    So you have a choice as an artist with words. You can either use the language you share with other people, or you can invent your own system of symbols and meanings. If you do the latter, you can only hope that someday someone will find it significant. Meanwhile, you're pleasing yourself, or there's no reason for doing it at all.

    Bob K.
    "The poet never asks for admiration; he wants to be believed."
    ...Jean Cocteau

  9. #39

    It's all right, Bob.

    True Bob. Thanks for the input - I've long been an admirer of Bell, and as for Picasso's Dora Maar, well, even I have to stop and wonder about that one! Chances taken by a very talented artist!



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